Draconic Summit Spring 2023 - panel-discussion-2

Is this the right channel for discussing recordings of presentations? I wasn't able to make today's live

Illia

Is this the right channel for discussing recordings of presentations? I wasn't able to make today's live

These are more so for discussions during the live panels. We got today's panels up on our YT here: https://www.youtube.com/@TheDraconicSummit/featured If you want to discuss the past panels further, one of the draconic experiences channels or the main nest would probably fit better! (edited)

Draconic Summit

Greetings! The draconic summit is a biannual online gathering hosted on discord that is draconic/dragonkin centric! This is an event for individuals to connect with others in the greater dragonkin/otherkin communities, share their unique experiences, and exchange knowledge! Anyone can attend however, no matter if they are draconic or not. The pu...

Got it!

By the way I’m not hosting this panel, I just had to set the stage up XD

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6:50 pm

I'm just gonna be listening in while working on an art thingy

Sounds good!

6:57 pm

I can hear you!

yes I could!

Hear you !

We hear you!

We can hear you

You sound good!!

science und rabbitholes, nice. Always a fun venture, that

Anybody got any lucid dreams already? If yes, please answer with any reaction

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Only once or twice

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I've only ever had one, but it was quite lame. Though at the same time, if it had been exciting, I probably would have waken up early.

I didn't know people thought lucid dreaming was a myth dragnsweat

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almost daily

I've had a few lucid dreams wherein I actually thought I was having a very vivid daydream and it wasn't until I woke up that I realized I was truly dreaming. I had full control but was also allowing my whims to control a lot of it.

only had one REAL one where I literally felt like I became myself there in my room... it was pretty wild

this make sense. I get better lucid dream when I have decent amount of sleep

Delta waves are also called slow waves, as the frequency is lower. Alpha and Beta waves are "faster" so the freq. is higher

Oh? So if the brain picks up those cycles after being waken up, and the REM cycle length is kept, is that also why dreams when going back to sleep are more likely? I notice myself that after waking up in the morning, when going back to sleep, dreams are much more likely.

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Ryuu | 夢化竜

this make sense. I get better lucid dream when I have decent amount of sleep

I don't even get dreams I can remember when I have poor sleep or stay up way too late

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When 90% of your dreams are about school/college/work.

I haven't noticed it on too many occasions, but I find that the time a dream takes can vary a lot from real time passing. I once went back to sleep after a work alarm went off, gave myself 15min and went back to sleep and had this LONG dream that felt like a literal day and a half of length in that 15min, it was VERY strange

7:21 pm

goes to show the mind can give you the sensation of long amts of time in more or less no time at all

Yup, can confirm that.

As someone who uses a lot of grounding techniques in my life, my dreams have a ton of reality checks, causing me to go lucid most of the time, quickly. The problem i have is that i'm apparently not allowed to lucid dream? Any time i go lucid, i'm kicked from sleep, as if i'm physically dragged back to wakefulness.

I've woke up and remember my dreams strongly, and then decide to go back to sleep. The second time I wake up , the memories are mostly faded

Ryuu | 夢化竜

I've woke up and remember my dreams strongly, and then decide to go back to sleep. The second time I wake up , the memories are mostly faded

Can relate to this, I would say I dream around 80% of the time and can remember at least some stuff directly after waking up

KinDD

Can relate to this, I would say I dream around 80% of the time and can remember at least some stuff directly after waking up

sometimes they last through the day right?

I cannot. I do not remember most of my dreams. I can realize that i have dreamed, but without any knowledge of what it was.

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Ryuu | 夢化竜

sometimes they last through the day right?

yes, very intense dreams I can remember up to years even!

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I'm finding nowdays if I come into something in dreams that I recognize as being not real for whatever reason, it'll cause me to wake up. Can be pretty annoying when it's a dream I like, although a pleasant help when a dream is very boring or filled with some drawn out repetition that you wish would end

I can recognize dream is dream when inside the dream, but sometimes I had a harder time realizing if some of my memories are the waking or the dreamed if the dream event was a mundane daily life one. Which can be... trippy.

I've never had a dream within a dream, i dont think.

do dream checks at the office to make sure you're not supposed to be on a beach somewhere >>;=)

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the inception style of dream is.. very exhausting. For me at least.

Dragonne

As someone who uses a lot of grounding techniques in my life, my dreams have a ton of reality checks, causing me to go lucid most of the time, quickly. The problem i have is that i'm apparently not allowed to lucid dream? Any time i go lucid, i'm kicked from sleep, as if i'm physically dragged back to wakefulness.

Yeah that's usually when you get too excited. I have it myself with almost any dragon-related dream, sadly. (edited)

it sounds a little like step to astral projection

Bluefire

Yeah that's usually when you get too excited. I have it myself with almost any dragon-related dream, sadly. (edited)

For most people, yes. I don't get excited, but i can tell the force acting on me is external. It's not me. It also throws me through the dream barrier, and can physically feel the shattering as i'm thrown through them. Incredibly annoying.

mine have been rather short like that

Dragonne

For most people, yes. I don't get excited, but i can tell the force acting on me is external. It's not me. It also throws me through the dream barrier, and can physically feel the shattering as i'm thrown through them. Incredibly annoying.

What do you mean by dream barrier ?

KinDD

What do you mean by dream barrier ?

The barriers that separate reality.

thank you so much!

Thank you so much <3

the limbo between waking and dreaming.... that's actually the place where I try to spend the most time at in order to transfer dream memories into conscious memories

Thank you for the panel! It was very informative!

Thanks a lot for the nice panel, can't wait 'til tomorrow.

I love listening to your panels Amber! They're always so interesting and you've got a great voice ^^

thank you for the panel! always loved lucid dream topics

awesome panel! i came in toward the end but reminds me of when i was in 5th grade and was super into lucid dreaming

It was really interesting yeah, thank you very much for hosting!!!

will you have any recording of this panel or notes or anything like that?

Ryuu | 夢化竜

the limbo between waking and dreaming.... that's actually the place where I try to spend the most time at in order to transfer dream memories into conscious memories

Yus, i typically can only access this "between" during special circumstances, such as when i'm extremely tired or sick. I go into this half-sleep state where i'm entirely conscious, but also dreaming. For when i'm sick, these become a recurring fever nightmare.

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A good dream sign for me is taking an impossibly difficult test. :P

Dragonne

Yus, i typically can only access this "between" during special circumstances, such as when i'm extremely tired or sick. I go into this half-sleep state where i'm entirely conscious, but also dreaming. For when i'm sick, these become a recurring fever nightmare.

I wonder if you can promote lucid dream, in your case, when you get yourself into extreme exhaustion. So when you are lucid, your body actually cannot wake up

@Amber It's nobody within the dream that's doing it. It's more like a force than a person.

Yeah had that too. There was actually a dream once where there was a dragon that was aware he was in a dream of mine, but not me. And he was the only one speaking English too :P (edited)

@Dragonne it can be a force from within, but maybe from a part of your subconscious that you are not aware yet

Ember

will you have any recording of this panel or notes or anything like that?

We are recording this panel and will get it on the summit's YT tonight

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Ryuu | 夢化竜

I wonder if you can promote lucid dream, in your case, when you get yourself into extreme exhaustion. So when you are lucid, your body actually cannot wake up

No. I can consciously allow these half-state dreams to go normally, or i can consciously go lucid within the dream. If i do the former, normal dream state happens, i'm just aware of it. If i go lucid within, i'm dragged out, like normal. And am consciously aware of the effects. Being thrown through the dream barrier is particularly powerful in this case. (edited)

And One strange thing about me is nightmares. I have them, but they do not induce fear at all. They just... happen and I experience them without emotion. And when I wake up I go: "oh, well, guess that happened". Also, some people say going to sleep in dreams is "dangerous". Is that true? (edited)

KinDD

@Dragonne it can be a force from within, but maybe from a part of your subconscious that you are not aware yet

I mean, possibly? But my subconscious is... weird. Probably because of my soul bond.

I've also had dreams before that were just a looping thought or set of events, over and over again. Read on a wiki once that could be because of short term memory failure. Wonder how that works.

Dragonne

I mean, possibly? But my subconscious is... weird. Probably because of my soul bond.

I mean you are the best to judge of course, but I know it from very traumatic events, that there are parts of me that "protect" my consciouss to get overwhelmed and this happens by blocking content

@Amber What if it doesnt last long enough to talk? My ejection happens the instant i become lucid.

KinDD

I mean you are the best to judge of course, but I know it from very traumatic events, that there are parts of me that "protect" my consciouss to get overwhelmed and this happens by blocking content

I mean, that's logical under normal circumstance, but what could be so traumatic about lucid dreaming in by itself? (edited)

thank you again! this was fascinating hope to come tomorrow if I can (edited)

Thank you!!

Thanks again!! Super interesting!

Thanks Amber!

Thank you so much, really interesting topic

danke Amber, sehr gut

Many thanks, lovely panel! It definitely helped me figure out how and why I've somewhat spontaneously started lucid dreaming in the last few months

Kiera Ember {it/its}

Thanks again!! Super interesting!

ember spotted dragneyesBIG

Thanks for panel!

Dragonne

I mean, that's logical under normal circumstance, but what could be so traumatic about lucid dreaming in by itself? (edited)

I think what KinDD means is that your lucid dreams might reveal something traumatic that is really disturbing, and you're subconsciously trying to protect yourself from that. It might help to keep trying.. with all due care.

Some of my lucid dreams have actually been disturbing for system members, but not for me, personally.

@Dragonne Well it is hypothetic, but if you are really lucid in the mean of the term by being conscious inside your subconscious, you can pull up parts that were not conscious before that. I do think we have an instance in or with us, that protects us from "falling apart". Like the saying goes, some doors cannot be closed again once opened. But like I said, just hypothesis, one of many.

that would make sense; there are things in our nature, the past or just things related to fears or dark corners we don't want to venture into that we subconsciously keep ourselves from

Yup, makes sense!

Amber

I think what KinDD means is that your lucid dreams might reveal something traumatic that is really disturbing, and you're subconsciously trying to protect yourself from that. It might help to keep trying.. with all due care.

I mean, yeah, i've got a lot of trauma in life, but this lucid ejection had been happening regularly for around 30 years. I'm unsure how much longer it will take to change. (edited)

@KinDD all the duct tape in the world can't reseal pandora's box, that is SO true... the internet does this to us constantly where you get search results for things you are SO not looking for

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@Dragonne From a spiritual point of view, maybe for you it can be a protective measure to "stay within your realm". If you have a split soul and would roam free, there is a possibility, that you "switch over" with your other side, I mean it is also "just" another plain of reality. What do you think? Could this happen ?

perhaps the trauma has you on edge and your mind jumps to full attention at anything "unusual"

KinDD

@Dragonne Well it is hypothetic, but if you are really lucid in the mean of the term by being conscious inside your subconscious, you can pull up parts that were not conscious before that. I do think we have an instance in or with us, that protects us from "falling apart". Like the saying goes, some doors cannot be closed again once opened. But like I said, just hypothesis, one of many.

wait... you make an excellent point by framing it that way... In that perspective, it's very important that my subconscious is actually where my draconic half an i connect, and share. Almost as if it's her subconscious. If this is true, her Seal would actively do exactly what you describe, and that's what it's actually designed to do.

KinDD

@Dragonne From a spiritual point of view, maybe for you it can be a protective measure to "stay within your realm". If you have a split soul and would roam free, there is a possibility, that you "switch over" with your other side, I mean it is also "just" another plain of reality. What do you think? Could this happen ?

This is actually why i have so many grounding techniques. To keep me sane compared to a combindation of trauma and the fact i'm living multiple lives simultaneously. So it's a very valid idea to think on! (edited)

Fascinating! Concurrent lifes are also a thing for me, actually. I've always felt as if some part of me exists beyond this reality. Only there's not so much of a barrier.

Dragonne

This is actually why i have so many grounding techniques. To keep me sane compared to a combindation of trauma and the fact i'm living multiple lives simultaneously. So it's a very valid idea to think on! (edited)

I do think that this is an enormous stressor to the mind, especially when memories or perceptions come up, that cannot be interpreted by the rational cognitions and experience we have here in this plain of reality (edited)

But yes, if all this is correct for me, then i'm right in feeling this force as external as it ejects me. Because it actually is external. it's an external effect originating from my draconic half's reality. And it also does mean exactly how i feel: as if i'm not allowed to lucid dream. Because the Seal will not let me. It risk too many of her deeper secrets being discovered.

KinDD

I do think that this is an enormous stressor to the mind, especially when memories or perceptions come up, that cannot be interpreted by the rational cognitions and experience we have here in this plain of reality (edited)

This is very true, though i'm also used to it. I actually use it to my benefit, actually, in my spiritual practices. The ability to wield disbelief and belief in equal measure, as well as ground out spiritual things like a ground wire in order to study or get to the raw truth of something. This, in part, lets me control symbolism among things, and construct or deconstruct mine or other's magic, as well. Plus, the benefit of having concurrent lives like i do is that my other half can help balance the stressors in my life. (That's actually why i've been do bad in these last few months. We're unable to balance due to circumstances on her side.) (edited)

I'd say it sounds like a very finely tuned balance.

8:16 pm

In my case, it sometimes feels like my "other half" would literally throw knowledge at me. Complex knowledge that's hard to wrap your mind around. And there's nothing much I can do to prevent it. It just overwhelms me, and I have to process it.

Amber

In my case, it sometimes feels like my "other half" would literally throw knowledge at me. Complex knowledge that's hard to wrap your mind around. And there's nothing much I can do to prevent it. It just overwhelms me, and I have to process it.

This is true, and somewhat similar for me. It's not so much they throw knowledge, and more than it's "controlled" via the subconscious. Deeply seated things, like important knowledge or memories sort of "filter" over. Less important things are tend not to. The Seal control certain, specific important things, as it's design is intended to do. However, it can only delay those important things at the deepest layers of our subconscious bond. So the flow is... almost steady, for me? We can work together to achieve a higher state of communication, but the Seal actually becomes more powerful in those moments, as we both become more directly connected to it. (edited)

I have experienced something vaguely similar to this. While I wouldn't say that I have a second half and I don't experience duality, per say, to a degree I feel this way about the knowledge of my dragon life. In essence it feels like there is this deep pool of knowledge that resides somewhere within me, and that pool is my truest, draconic, self. Who I am right now is sort of a shadow of that, but slowly, year by year, I am able to "drink" more of the pool and become more and more my truest self. Except sometimes some force within my subconscious yeets me headlong into the pool and tells me to sink or swim. In those events, it's like my truest self is trying her hardest to become the me that is here, now, right this instant and it's overwhelming in the extreme. I was a patient dragon, and so eventually she subsides, but leaves me with a lot of new info and ideas to sort through and figure out. It's overwhelming but also euphoric, because for those few moments I feel like my truest self even if I am in a body that doesn't match that self at all.

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Drakmanka

I have experienced something vaguely similar to this. While I wouldn't say that I have a second half and I don't experience duality, per say, to a degree I feel this way about the knowledge of my dragon life. In essence it feels like there is this deep pool of knowledge that resides somewhere within me, and that pool is my truest, draconic, self. Who I am right now is sort of a shadow of that, but slowly, year by year, I am able to "drink" more of the pool and become more and more my truest self. Except sometimes some force within my subconscious yeets me headlong into the pool and tells me to sink or swim. In those events, it's like my truest self is trying her hardest to become the me that is here, now, right this instant and it's overwhelming in the extreme. I was a patient dragon, and so eventually she subsides, but leaves me with a lot of new info and ideas to sort through and figure out. It's overwhelming but also euphoric, because for those few moments I feel like my truest self even if I am in a body that doesn't match that self at all.

Very! That's are like the most important memories and knowledge for her to me. I know a lot about my home because my home is very important to my other half. Likewise, her job/love/career is being a historian, so the major eras and events of those eras are very self-important to her. As she also delves into histo-culture, this includes a lot of "why" context for those events and modern society. Thus why i know so much about the general state of our society, and it's evolutions over time. However, there are many things that disinterest her that i personally feel as if i need more context, since i'm lacking. How exactly do all the Clans operated internally? More information about the Eastern Continent would be extremely helpful to me. So many things i want to know, that she does not really care about! She understand the very basics of our genetics, but not at a scientific level, like her mother does. *I want to knoooow!* (edited)

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